Andrès Duany Responds To Critics In Vancouver

16 January 2007 - 2:00pm

The father of New Urbanism takes on avant-garde architects and environmentalists as he talks about his latest project in Vancouver, Canada.

Andrès Duany is set to reshape a piece of East Vancouver into another trademark urban village that the co-founder of the Congress for New Urbanism is famous for. Planned over a period of 15-20 years, city officials have entrusted Duany and his firm to design the proposed East Fraserlands Project, which they hope will revitalize the area's industrial waterfront.

"[While] the buildings themselves will be designed by various local architects...[many] are aghast that a New Urbanist will soon be let loose" to masterplan the area.

"The Tyee caught up with Duany for a conversation when he visited Vancouver recently. Here is what he had to say on...The problem with architects who treat cities like modern art galleries:"

" 'You cannot make a city with avant-gardist architects, because an avant-gardist architect is continually trying to do something new, and to stand out...You can make some great buildings: avant-garde architects are really good these days, no question. But you can't make a city.' "

Source: The Tyee, January 16, 2007

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The avant garde architect's

The avant garde architect's alternative is to have everyone live in underground bunkers since it challenges conventional (read: logical) thinking and is different for the sake of being different. Everything has to be a personal "exploration" of the latest architectural fad and new worthless artificial materials (with fake space-theme names) otherwise you are standing in the way of their utopian vision of the "future" (which looks like New Haven). And its specifically the successful and popular New Urbanism movement that they see standing in the way.

Don't hate the Avant Garde or the New Urbanist

I actually don’t view avant-gardes and new urbanists as necessarily being so at odds with one another. They both serve different functions and needs. One is primarily artistic and the other primarily functional. Both are necessary aspects of great urbanism. Hence they both can appropriately work in their respective places. Avante-Garde buildings work well as civic structures for the most part. Meanwhile traditional urbanistic ideas work well for our everyday buildings. Together they can produce and even greater, non-competing, outcome. The key is context and moderation. I would never make the argument for every building to be a Frank Gehry, yet at the same time I would also not argue for everything looking like the Kentlands (MD), Propect (CO), or New Town (MO).

I think the cover of the New Civic Art illustrates this concept best. On the cover, the Gerhy building in Balboa is shown terminating the end of a vista. The building breaks every urbanistic rule as it strives for artistic expression. The key in this instance however, is that the view of the building is framed by silent, repetitive, functional, high quality urbanism.

Essentially the Zaha Hadid and Gerhry buildlings have become the "Cathedrals" of our time. They are meant to break every rule, and should! They convey the artistic ideas, aspirations, and technical prowess of our civilization. The cathedrals of Europe were at one time "avante-garde" and they also broke conventional urbanistic rules of their time, in a search for artistic expression. The key is that high quality, responsible, repetitive urbanism should serve as a canvass from which these "Cathedrals" should sing out. 98% of our buildings should be responsible urbanistic buildings, built upon a tradition of acquired knowledge a sort of "best practices" as you will. The other remaining 2% should be our most important buildings, churches, city halls, museums, etc., in which architects can fully explore artistic expression.

In conclusion, if every building were a Gehry, nothing would stand out and we would live in a form of chaos. On the other hand, if everything were Kentlands life would be sort of boring and uninspiring. It is the marriage of these two movements (Avant-Garde/New Urbanism), along with environmentalism, which is setting the stage for the greatest achievements in urbanism, awaiting in the 21st Century!

ps. I really wish the Disney concert hall in Los Angeles could have somehow been set in the middle of a plaza surrounded by refined high quality urbanism. This plaza could have become an even greater high quality civic space than already exists in the northern downtown.

Avant Gardism and Urban Design

You are right to say that fabric buildings should follow the rules and form a repetitive background, while important public buildings should be allowed to break the rules and stand out from the urban fabric.

But note that this is a key principle of traditional urban design, and it is incorporated in many New Urbanist codes. The avant-gardists themselves want to make every building new and different, and they dislike the codes that require conventional fabric buildings.

Of course, this sort of traditional urban design does not require its important buildings to be in the current avant-gardist style. I think the style of Gehry, Libeskind, et al. is a fad that everyone will be laughing at in fifty years. Now, it looks new and different, but nothing ages less gracefully than the aging avant garde.

Charles Siegel

Agreed

I agree with everything you have said Charles, I guess the reason I posted my response was just to point that being Avant-Garde is not all bad. Too often we slam Avante-garde's without at least acknowledging that they too have their benefits, or the fact that they do indeed have a place in our built environment.

I do agree that they are fads....but what style throughout history has not been one? Baroque was a fad, post modernism was a fad, international style was a fad, even impressionism was a fad, but the point is that each and every one of those fads did indeed contribute to who we are as a society and to our understanding of the world.

I guess what I’m ultimately saying is that when we are critical of avant-garde's let’s at least make note or their contributions to society as well.

When will he ever go away?!

Andres Duany is such a freakin' joke! He makes the rest of us planners look bad. When will he ever retire or at least shut up!?

As much as I totally despise Peter Calthorpe and his extreme elitism, at least he attempts to take a quasi-intelligent approach to the endless diatribes that he preaches to the "masses". Duany just figuratively "hits below the belt" when it comes to verbal confrontations with his legitimate critics.

And he doesn't like environmentalists? Pathetic...

Duany and Environmentalists

Notice that Duany criticizes old-line environmentalists who just focus on more greenery in the city, and he says he is a new type of environmentalist:

"They want less lot coverage. They want more permeable surface. They want naturalistic landscaping that is as close to looking like nature as possible. ... [But] urbanism is environmentalism by other means. The environmentalism of urbanism is not about more green -- it's about having people willingly living in high density. It's about willingly walking rather than driving, and willingly taking transit."

I think he doesn't realize how much environmentalists have been influenced by his work. A decade or two ago, I was on the committee that developed an urban growth policy for the Sierra Club SF Bay Chapter, and much of work was inspired by Duany.

By now, I think most environmentalists realize that building pedestrian and transit-oriented development is vital, and so they favor higher density.

Duany has led the way in developing principles for building walkable neighborhoods, and these principles have made modernist auto-oriented urban design obsolete. That is obviously an immense accomplishment.

Charles Siegel

But HAS he led the way? Or has he followed others?

I believe most of his projects are greenfield, auto-oriented, mixed-use developments packaged as higher density, lower ecological footprint type projects. A new look on an old real estate money-making formula. Even Calthorpe (as much as I hate him) has more to show for environmentally-friendly urbanism than Duany. And Calthorpe DESPISES CEQA (California Environmental Quality Act), Sierra Club, and most other Bay Area environmental organizations (with perhaps the exception of the Greenbelt Alliance).

Unless you count his example of the luxury, high-rise "Auqua" development in Miami Beach.

Calthorpe, Duany, Environment

Calthorpe spoke to the Sierra Club Urban Growth Policy committee that I was on. He criticized the Sierra Club briefly, because they had blocked his early project in Brooklyn. But he listened to us when we told him that there were also SC members in favor of New Urbanist development. That was over a decade ago, and now the SC generally is in favor of pedestrian-oriented development (with a few exceptions).

Whether or not Duany's projects are greenfield, the fact remains that he overturned the principles of modernist city planning and established the principles of pedestrian-oriented planning. The modernists said we should separate functions, put the functions on large superblock surrounded by arterial streets and with internal streets for access only, with design each superblock so it face inward and away from the street. Duany showed that we should build a connected street grid with smaller blocks and with uses facing the sidewalk and streets.

I repeat that, even if we overlook everything else they have accomplished, this alone is an immense accomplishment by Duany and other New Urbanist planners.

Charles Siegel

Criticism.

Calthorpe CONTINUES to bash the Sierra Club and CEQA on a regular basis, at least here in the Bay Area. He made a fool out of himself at CNU XIII in Pasadena, started going on this rambling diatribe of why he should leave CNU and start his OWN organization because he hates Duany and everyone else for that matter. Read the most recent article on him in the San Francisco Chronicle.

Duany did NOTHING to espouse or futher the critique on non-modernist, non-superblock developments. He merely cut and pasted the work of Vincent Scully and Leon/Rob Krier and took all the credit for it (in a mean-spirited, condescending sort of way I might add).

Followed people or not...

I believe half of DPZ's projects are Greenfield and half are infill! And even if they are still auto-centric, in large part, what city is truly not auto-centric? People still drive cars in New York, DC, San Fran and every other major city in the U.S. The point is not the elimination of the car but the reduction in its use and impacts.

I certainly did a lot more walking in the Kentlands than I have in other post 1950's urban environments.

Stop looking at the glass half empty and realize that it is also half full! A step in the right direction is better than no step at all, which appears to be your record since you won’t qualify my desire to debate your own personal record.

Infill?

Examples please. Then we can debate further.

Link

follow this link, then click on urban infill on the left.

http://www.dpz.com/projects.aspx

Seen them, not impressed.

All upper-income projects for upwardly mobile urban professionals and baby boomer retirees. Nothing even close to providing a positive contribution to the North American urban fabric. Hundreds of other architects are designing the same kinds of projects all over the country as we speak. Nothing unique or influential about DPZ's work whatsoever.

Can you say, Playa Vista? Google it and then get back to me.

Look again...

You need to look again because not all of those projects are upper income...Second, are you saying the upper income people should not have access to high quality urbanism?
Third, the reason hundreds of other architects are designing the same kinds of projects is because he and others championed them for years!!! In the 80's people thought that they were crazy and that no one would voluntarily live in these projects.

Lastly, I don’t need to Google Playa Vista. I’ve BEEN THERE! And if I remember correctly its current built form does not reflect the original DPZ design. Playa Vista's original plan was tampered with by other architects, planners, bureaucracy and nimbyism just to name a few. Just because it is sub optimal doesn't mean it shouldn't be praised for at least trying to break the southern California sprawl pattern.

ps playa Vista was a long....time ago. DPZ has inevitably improved their practice since those early days. How about you Google NewTown at St Charles (MO) or Prospect in (CO).

More on Duany & Environementatlists

Living in high density compact walkable environments allows us to preserve more virgin untouched nature. What could be more environmental that that?

The point is that the new urbanist movement and the green movements are actually coalescing into one movement. Green Urbanism!

duany & enviros

the guy is good, but he sure is one arrogant prick. i saw him lead a charette in pacifica several months ago, and while his results were good, he came off rather abrasive and rather impolitic - not a good idea when it comes to getting something approved on the ballot.

his little quip about enviros is a perfect example. while i can't speak for vancouver enviros, his statement dissing greenery is simply idiotic and liable to turn off more people that it attracts. for one, people like increased greenery from a purely aesthetic standpoint - he goes on bashing avant garde architects because they create things that turn most middle class type people off, then proceeds to complain that people want to see greenery in their city. second, he thoroughly ignores the fact that greenery improves stormwater management function in a city and can be strategically designed for a dense urban context. they're certainly not in opposition, or at least don't have to be.

Dogmatic and Shrewd

Duany is completely dogmatic and proselytizes the wonderous benefits of New Urbanism like a "hell, fire, and damnation" preacher would during a Kentucky camp meeting revival in the Second Great Awakening of the early 1800's.

He leverages his Princeton/Yale Ivy League resume, his Cuban developer father's professional networking contacts, his wife's Philadelphia Main Line debutante/patrician lineage, and his Vincent Scully friendship, coupled with simplistic techniques of garnering attention through slick marketing and support of the masses (like an evangelical preacher), to bolster his own political and professional career. Quite similar to how George W. Bush has exploited the poor, uneducated masses of Christian Fundamentalist voters in the midwest and south in order to gain more votes (illegally) and stay in power.

Andres Duany is the ultimate embodiment of snake oil salesmanship in the tradition of P.T. Barnum, Anthony Robbins, and David DeAngelo.

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